Edip Yuksel (E) Noam Chomsky – Democracy, Plutocracy, Palestinians, Kurds


you are the most celebrated and the most reference modern scholars and also you are very combo and I saw your name in David Horowitz professors F is highlighted and your global activist you are very humble and I consider you a guy with great brain mind and great heart that’s really we see someone in your prominence that goes and support the people who are vilified not supported and now my question the first question I would have hopefully six question and if you have more time hopefully seventh question with a little bit off the topic what and I don’t see you in much in mass media when I came here 22 years ago I was like poliana I’m still grateful being this country to have freedom that is true Constitution guaranteed though I think it’s slipping away in certain way gradually now the mass media we don’t see you and when I ask my students in philosophy class how many of them heard you feel hands up but in the world you are more recognized by general population one thing comes to mind whether this conspiracy what do you think true not just me accidentally any dozen but for example I do have regular columns that are distributed by the New York Times said together which reaches every newspaper in the country and it mostly lives in the world I don’t think one has ever been picked up in the United States covered area but elsewhere I think not even mentioned Europe they’re published month except southern Europe they’re published in the southwest of all the countries which in fact they morph read in many ways and they have more less free political systems often the case that they’re actually a little moral and I don’t think that’s an accident the effect if you look at the history of propaganda and indoctrination it’s quite interesting the huge propaganda industries the biggest one ever is the US public relations industry in fact it used to call itself propaganda now that’s not a nice word ‘aslim with the early the earliest manuals in the PR industry were sent of coal probably animal and its main it developed it these industries which are enormous the development in the free countries in Britain in the United States and for every bats naturally recorded at the reason which was conscious it was recognized that people had won enough rights through popular struggled that was getting quiter to control a little bit for us and if it’s part of control people by force yet find some other way and the other way is control of attitudes and opinions in fact it was very conscious written about subscribe the people are quote the people are stupid and ignorant and for their own good we have to make sure that we they’re responsible and they’re called whether we are we run things and they can be spectators but not participants don’t have to keep matter our here great where does public intellectual in the United States in the 20th century water Lipman regret decision wasn’t progressivism Wilson Roosevelt Kennedy his view was we have to protect ourselves from the trampling and the war of the bewildered the ignorant and meddlesome Outsiders the general public always for their own good exactly as to stupid ignorant put that manufacturing consent well because that’s his phrase my board at the end maybe others and the propaganda the street was called engineering simply the same way and so they next quite good sense and it said this no conspiracy it’s just internal nature it’s internalized by the intellectual classes sometimes it’s twelve literally so for example is a concept of objectivity that’s used in the media and this worked in journalism tools and it’s it’s discussed by editors objectivity means reporting accurately what said within the Beltway in the human service so if you have something discussed within the Beltway crazy is no matter what slipped out and so on you recorded accurately and the results are sometimes the best time may be one example right now which is really quite urgent I mean within the Beltway the line is the greatest threat to peace in the world was here at the presidential debate the commentary on the greatest threat in the world well it raises a couple of questions first of all who thinks is a threat but a second lead but what is the threat certainly what can you do about it whatever it is well the answers are pretty straightforward who thinks it’s a threat the United States and say all the rest of the world most of the world strongly supports Iran’s right to enrich uranium denounces the sanctions and so on the Arab world is interesting the propaganda line here is that the Arabs support the United States and that’s not totally false the dictators exactly not the people the populations strong that doesn’t like that but hatred of democracy is so profound and deep seeded that if the population overwhelmingly opposes us and the dictators support us they support us and that’s 100% effective blocking the space of public opinion which are taken by the leading US politicians is very thick reported at the show but so that’s what about what the threat is you can learn that from the Pentagon and US intelligence the basic threat is is deterrence they might get in their way if we want to use force in violence the other thread is what they call destabilization like they’re trying to expand their influence we’re supposed to run so that’s the threat what can you do about it that’s the most interesting part a very simple way of addressing whatever you think the problem is bigger large very straightforward way of addressing moved to establish a nuclear weapons-free zone in the rich overwhelming international support for that the Arab world non-aligned countries I’m supportive so overwhelming that even the United States has to formally agree but with the qualification the qualifications great idea but not now the task excluded endless there’s a conference coming up in a couple of months international conference move forward on this if you think there’s a strip that’s the way of addressing personal eating those sanctions no bombing consequence there can’t be any it won’t get anywhere as long as the US need to unless there’s popular pressure here the u.s. is not going to change as well the American public whatever sentence there can’t be pressure here unless anybody knows about here’s where the media come in there has been a hundred percent conformant literally now you couldn’t achieve that in totalitarian state it’s done without conspiracy without pressure just by internal subordination to power which is internalized and I think that’s the crucial part that’s the actually one of the founders of political science realist political science stuff made of political science not some work until he once described the pathology of American intellectuals as what he called their conformist subservience to those in power and that’s that it’s not it’s not kind of chosen this just for you you don’t even get to be a person cool the neck respected intellectually very rare unless you internalizes know you know if this cognitive dissonance does you know if you net you can listen there’s lots of it because people recognize are this problem I may have an interesting you know the journals extra by fair this group fairness and accuracy in reporting yeah of course where there hasn’t been their last issue that short article which the discussive colloquy with the managing editor of the New York Times or sometimes official was asked about why how they were reporting the political campaign they’re just reporting every while I as a statement of fact that I’m leaving idols he said just what I said before I said that’s what it means to be objective then they asked one of their top reporters yes we were reporting what they say in Washington accurately now they’re not saying anything but they didn’t even raise this but it was asked they say well they’re not saying anything it’s important this time Cartman’s business they’re doing exactly what sounds right and what they’re doing well I also meant like Christians in this country especially the wrong way Christians wrong wink I call them and they are quarter to and I think in that part when I see co-opted yeah Christian’s got a wrong wink I called right the right-wing Christians and they were to church they say peace love your neighbor and they say the golden rule but when they come out they vote for the bigger military for the first three centuries after Christ Christians were persecuted the harsh person has a reason for that you really do hospitals this radical passes that’s Romans are a lot of that so they were viciously the person until a year 350 when the emperor constantine adopted Christianity as the official religion of thee well they work with Roman endeavor and then the cross which had been the symbol of suffering and the persecuted people that was put on the shield of the road legions got the offensive Wow one of the great historians of Christianity Thomas could it says at that point the Church of the persecuted became the Church of the persecutors and it remained that way until 1962 1962 Vatican to the 23rd tried to get the church to go back to the Gospels that it had an effect yes better than Latin American bishops and priests no they went out to try to organize dependence to organize in communities where they would read the Gospels which is extremely severe yeah I mean read doesn’t mean just say that work you know let me just think about what the words mean and organize to try to and themselves from the are in which been the u.s. reaction was quite interesting us immediately went to war against the church and if you look for him 62 to 89 there was a bitter world war against the church lots of religious martyrs Archbishop collection slaughtered the US aren’t quite open about it if you go to the School of the Americas were they training Latin American officers but one of their talking points advertised influences that the US Army helped defeat Liberation Theology Liberation Theology was the attempt we’re not having any of that stuff so that’s the history of the church and it’s it sent us you know there always were some critics around the fringes like everyone but these are the general tendencies and the same with the muhammad and jesus they were not capitalist just a the other way around they were for the pool for the week and then but exactly what I hope that we can cover all these things that the crew did not show up therefore I have my former student I found her here and therefore we don’t have microphone I thought that its caption this is a top-of-the-line camera camcorder now I want to go it is related and the second question is about so-called democracy when I go to the Walmart I see what happened as investment issues go to the baskin-robbins ice cream do you know ice cream company about 30 some plus okay 30 plus flavor of ice cream norm and but in this country we have more than 300 million people with diverse backgrounds with diverse ethnic religious and cultural background we have only two parties and this really baffles me and it is somehow system is designed in a way that punishes those people who would like to work for third party what do you think about that accurate to say we have only 140 we have what’s called a business border yep that’s two factions they’re full Democrats Republicans and there’s somewhat different but if you want to take a look at what the two-party system which goes way back but its current form developed since the Civil War let’s take a look at the newspapers that’s when the day after the election and they all had the maps rhythmic red and blue red and blue the Confederacy is red the ignores is blue no they’ve actually changed the names that happened in the sixties up until the 1960s the Confederacy was Democrat and the North was Republican during the 60s civil rights legislation was passed and some limited rights were given its African Americans which costed great fury and anger among the dominant you know they ruling the governor of the way things are and Richard Nixon was a good politician where he initiated what he called his Southern Strategy that is to take over the racist South and call more publicly and that worked very well were other things that contributed to the time but there were a lot of interesting things actually learn of liberals contributed to it in many ways but anyway it happened so the names have shifted but a founder of this name and in fact if you look at American politics after the Civil War the politics the two parted there had been parted with the parties that emerged became sectional parties but it was actually a slogan you both breeze you so if you shopped for the Confederates you would have been credit there was some mixture because the northern Catholic workers and it’ll be Democrat but they were kind of stucked in time any style systems you know Irish politicians kind of a little mix but that’s basically what it was and it pretty much stays like that because the name changed one effect is that both parties very quickly were taken over by manufacturing and Spanish so they both became right-wing business words but not class-based parties the US doesn’t have a parliamentary system so there’s a big barrier to start with against getting other voices in but the basic structure of the system is there’s a friendly business run society that much more so than Europe you know kind of reasons but it’s true that one reason why the history of the labor movement in the United States is so violent much more so than Europe and welfare measures knitted by European standards a lot of a lot of the consequences and interesting sources but the effect on the party system is you get a one-party – faction system yep it’s effective you look very interesting work in the political science leaders rejected it they take the most recent and the gold standard the business work what they can put includes is from study of polling which is expensive to know about attitudes in the policy which person that turns out to be if you look at the income your lowest the bottom seventy percent has no influence on policy don’t pay attention so there are essentially disenfranchised as you move up the level a bit more influence when you get to the top you get what you want and if you look at the outcome of the last election dislodge the most are acting the fact is the correlation of income level devoted it’s almost a straight line if you go from poorest to the richest it gets more and more Republican act if you go above it was approximately the median income $50,000 about that Ronnie that’s what and that kind of understates the fact because almost half the population gonna vote and overwhelmingly they’re poor and overwhelmingly their democratic and probably the reason they don’t vote is that intuitively without studying political science tax they know because the change doesn’t make any different whether they say yet this is a land of contradiction to me it’s kind of like Janis with two faces for example freedom why they enjoy here though the loudspeaker in the end of the few and what we have the highest prison population in the world we preach the world about freedom that that’s Bruce management yeah that’s right that’s it’s rated yeah war on crime soulful drugs but it has to do with the neoliberal policies all across the world there’s been a neoliberal assault against the populations that’s different effects in different places States but it’s all in the United States one effect was to sharply change the income distributions so you have an enormous it’s been wealth created but it’s going into very few bottles so you have extreme concentration of wealth which affects the political system immediately and although there’s been a decision have to be done to offshore manufacturing which is fine for financial institutions from an enormous to be in this very honorable to working people superfluous population one thing you do and yeah freak them yeah I just I want to do this view contradictions the opportunity this celebrated we have opportunity but recently this exactly it’s just the opposite and also recently Gini index I look at it the United States is among the worst countries top-five Chile Mexico and the United States Turkey my home country and Israel the foreman Turkey and Turkey in Turkey and Israel the worst countries I call them the more the worst immoral countries those reasons potentially yeah that’s since energy yeah they’ve never pulled out say us early stage saltador a rule Israel it’s recent it’s like the US since the 8th just be kind of social democratic time but citizen became part of does the occupation partly because the reliance when the u.s. came to mimic the u.s. Mexico were some very much every of us influence Turkey has got this actually and I want to go to of course human rights I see my god I was incredible told she’s shocked when I see these colors and this talking heads with ties with God well grooming they are trying to justify torture unbelievable shock for me and of course we know the list of the wars it’s worse than you think yeah I mean takes a bushes torture I think he was unfairly criticized because the torture that was carried out the u.s. ratification it only it ratified in I did but only after it was rewritten the Senate rewrote it and they rewrote it to exclude a certain category of torture that was called metal 3 meaning the kind of torture did then leave marks and that’s the kind of torture that is in the CIA manuals they picked it up from the KGB discovered years ago that the most effective way to turn a person into a vegetable is what’s called mental torture isolation threats you know all this kind of stuff it’s much better than electrodes you know that CIA picked that up and that’s was in the CIA manuals and that’s what the u.s. find and that’s pretty much what the CIA didn’t really do I stood this book 110 Ammal by David Tate’s David X was in Australia yeah is he journalist today one who’s done things we could happen to be in Afghanistan only the northern wouldn’t the Northern Alliance came down they picked him up when they sold him as a bounty to the Americans and he’s treated viciously at first didn’t Afghanistan them in Guantanamo our story they were at any anything they just kind of concocted a story it’s a major ok but he’s Australian so finally they I should get him out to a stretch ever he was free under some limitations so he’s able to write about and most of the people aren’t but if you take a look at the torture its within the framework of the accepted us torture actually the main historian of torture very good scholar Albert Floyd Musa console he’s written about this points out that this is normal us a lot of the criticisms of quite unfair now it’s true that these guys kind of went off fitting them but the main criticisms are well within the framework of standard us burger in fact you go to a maximum-security prison in the United States I love the Turkish prison for 40 years I know how brutal it is and also I suffered torture about one year and both mental and physical and that would I ever I consider these guys worse than animals the worse animals I just I have personal also an experience of what this guy’s trying to justify no I want to the third question I don’t want to tell you anymore I just go ahead yeah in recent years are over one backed by the United States yep like the worst crimes were in the nineties you know better than I did was real about 80% of the arms were coming from the US as torture and terror and violence with us alarms but in 1998 was one of the years of state terror and torture exactly Clinton sent more arms and that one year then the entire Cold War combined up to the onset of the counterinsurgency trying to find a reference for this in the u.s. address whether they had a very good correspondent sometimes in the Kurdish this is my question I see the Kurdish issue Turkish government is one of the most racist governments it was in the Constitution when I wrote that Journal article on democracies because Turkey had the habit of bending parties the Constitution Court been so many parties therefore the name of my articles cannibal democracies in the name of protecting democracy go are keep banging the parlance political parties a paradox and the Kurdish population the Kurdish language was banned in Turkey at that time the constitution article was not referring to the word courage anyone even to utter the word Mountain terms yeah the band language and says according to the chrome and then Kurdish people could not sing in your own language and give their names to kids conditionings and Kurdish towns incredible actually I asked because a trial under a military tribunal put it finally I did go out to the director and with Turkish intellectual activist good people hi Denise but one thing was quite interesting which I never reported when we were walking through the streets and caricature if the people with me you know the brightness if they saw children playing whose clothes happen to have the mixture of clothes you know would be the Kurdish color they directed us somewhere else because there were security people and television crews and they told me later that if they found a collection of children I want to cut my questions short because we have another appointment coming yeah the Kurdish issue right now they are on hunger strike and they are very arrogant basically racist people really they become they they are in denial they don’t see their racism I want to talk about what palestinian-israeli issue and I know about your position but I personally don’t think that two state is possible practical after so much gerrymandering and basically getting settlements every corner they wish and come out NEBOSH Adama whether you heard of him he is a attorney a lawyer in Washington DC american palestinian and together with some jewish friends they established a kind of organization promoting to state what country solution and to account a federal and device to protect the israelis concern regarding population 50/50 and by this way having both of Stanley both nation live in peace proposing 470 oh you see nobody’s 170 years without a break writing about it and so on but I’m different from them I want to achieve to achieve it pay attention to the real world and yeah ask what can be done at this moment to move towards well pre 1948 when this was one of my name preoccupations you could imagine moving towards it directly 48 1967 there was another possibility that time Israel conquered the whole territory he could have moved directly towards some kind of federalism of the Tigers right I wrote about it it was bitterly denounced across the board nobody want to hear about by 1975 that became impossible because the Palestinian national issue reach the international agenda then you get the two state efforts of overwhelming international consensus the United States acceptable Akkad ever since night let’s go to today what are the options unfortunately a lot of my friends are in this scene they’re living under is serious delusion they don’t recognize that the that the options are not two states or one state the options are two states or the u.s. who exactly what they’re doing and exactly what they’re doing is separating Gaza from the West Bank in Gaza a new prison of taking over whatever is a valium in the West Bank we just want to have very few Palestinians so there won’t be any part by the issue that won’t be any civil rights struggle and they’ll leave the rest of the Palestinians volcanic comes that’s the alternative to two states what you just described is a nice idea but it’s not one of the alternatives yeah we don’t get much about it I hear a lot about it way too much I need to methane me you never actually to hear much more about it now once they when I was feasible okay Ben from 67 to 75 you heard nothing except a condemnation of anybody starting to raise it starting the last few years of the mainstream media are willing to tolerate so you get our New York Times fragment I said fragment so the interesting question is why I didn’t want to accept it now when they weren’t willing to accept it when it was feasible and I think there’s a reason now if you there is next door by the way they succeeded he was keeping the principles in the back of their mind thank you my must question is a little personal its opportunity to answer or not if there was god which I argue there is God in fact I had debate with the president of atheist organization in New Jersey and also with the Michael Shermer skeptic Society but if there’s a God if you had chance to ask a question and get answer and a trailer get an answer what would be your question to know and your feelings or Thomas Paine if there is a history of the world I don’t see what other first of all if it’s the god of the Old Testament did a genocide on meaning that none of the Old Testament Genesis idol they paired that every cannon I mean God is so such a genocide all fanatic that he was willing to destroy every living thing on earth because I’m human being offended you know we have to have brain check for this debate I think I think yeah I disagree with that I think I have very good discussion for that but hopefully I don’t know whether you are interested to discussion of this issue problem of evil and what was your prayer yeah something that wanted too many things yeah this human species no it’s not a precipice facing disaster the others nuclear war which gets worse over here there’s an abstract situation I’d like to be able to deal with those otherwise nothing else to talk about that’s sir thank you very much more yeah

Maurice Vega

29 Responses

  1. Edip Abicim,
    Noam Beyin konuşmasını tam ve net duyamıyoruz bu anlamayı zorlaştırıyor. Alt yazı konulursa daha anlaşılır yapar. Teşekkur ederim.

  2. Bir Edip Yüksel klasiği daha.2002 deki İst.konferanslarnda "probably the most intellectual being on earth" diye tanıtımı yapılan ünlü muhalif düşünce ve kuramlar sahibi dil bilim adamı,özellikle yaşadığı Amerikan egemenlerinin ve ordusunun emperyal dünya politikaları ve aslen yahudi olmasına rağmen İsrail'in Filistin katliamlarının karşısında kontra açıklamalarla alenen net duruş göstermiş bir filozof bir entellektüel.Bir hayli yaşlanmış.Duyuluyor bir şeyler ama anlaşılmıyor.Takdirler Edip Bey.

  3. My recent interview with Noam Chomsky on Democracy, Plutocracy, Palestinians and Kurds

    Edip Yuksel (E) Noam Chomsky – Democracy, Plutocracy, Palestinians, Kurds

  4. I took it differently.. He justifiably have a question: how can a Benevolent and Omnipotent God allow so much suffering in the world. Al he knows about God is distorted and contradictory stories provided by corrupt religious scholars and clergymen. You might be surprised, but I find him much closer to recognizing God than many of those who preach about God.

  5. EDIP, selma kaylu diye bir kisi sana KÜRTCE bir cümle yazmis ve seni bu röportaj icin kutlamis, sen ise ona geri yazmadin, acaba geri yazmamanin sebebi KÜRTCEDEN utaniyor olmandan mi kaynaklaniyor…mesela hep T yada E ile baslayan videolarina bir kere bile olsa K yani kürtce de eklesen olmaz mi? bu soru hakaret deyil, samimi bir sorudur..

  6. Lol @ "My crew didn't show up, so I found this person here that may or may not be able to operate the camera." 😀

    Nice interview though 🙂

  7. Naturally he associates nuclear war with Israel … They are the likely initiators. As for believing in God this is a personal decision and all discussion would be about religion if he declares this . But he values the gospels and often speaks of them. I would not try to associate him with religion simply because you are trying to sell your own. He believes, that the facts are what are important to oppressed people, spirituality is a personal decision which he has no interest in influencing.

  8. Well, I was lucky that a few of my former students were at MIT. Perhaps, I would stll be able to push the button. Well, life is not perfect, and neither I. So, I make lemonade when I get a lemon 🙂

  9. God was portrayed in the Bible as a "genocidal maniac", to quote Chomsky, because God was patterned unconsciously after the prophets' own cruel, abusive parents.

  10. I think the only weird thing about your surprise is that he as atheist actually read the bible – while most Christians don't. What he says is a mere statement of fact about the bible, wherein god does many vicious things. It's not even hidden or anything. Abraham has to convince God not to wipe out everyone indiscriminately – and in the 10 commandments God calls himself jealous and punishing children to the 4th generation.

    As for nukes: His main concern is Pakistan. Which got them with US help.

  11. He is to my knowledge an Agnostic.

    I don't see how its hating something, when you don't believe in something.
    (or saying ''I dont know if something exist'').

    What would you say if someone said ''you hate'' Budha, Allah, Zeus or Ra, because you dont believe in them?
    Assuming you are a Christian…

  12. He does largely put the blame on any Nuclear war on Israel and the US, if not for launching the bombs themselves then for being either intransigent or simply pushing the opposing side far beyond breaking point.

    And believe it or not, many of the greatest thinkers in this world have been atheists or at least agnostic, included in that least are Chomsky, Orwell, Einstein, Russell, and many scientists and social scientists today. Chomsky isn't an anti-theist, but he is very much a-religious.

  13. Greetings Prof Yuksel, we as Kurds are honoured to claim that you as an eminent scholar are a concious Kurd who supports Kurds' fight for their rights against the unrelenting onslaught of state-sponsored terrorism by Turkey. I would be grateful if you can help me in writing a paper on the subject of state sponsored terror in Turkey against Kurds.

  14. Thank you for sharing your video, thoughts and questions, Edip Yuksel. Good questions, and good answers.

    I know it will probably never eventuate, but as I share Chomsky's basic view on the last question you asked him, it would make my day if you ever managed to spend some more time discussing it with him.

    If this does ever occur, please please please please video it and share it with the rest of us 🙂

  15. Altyazıyı hazırlayana teşekkürler…
    Beğeniyle izledim; Edip Yüksel ile konuşma fırsatını yakaldığı için Chomsky kendini şanslı hissetmeli bence 🙂

    Chomsky bazı konularda önyargılı olsa da güzel bir söyleşiydi, teşekkürler EDİP YÜKSEL!

  16. Noam is such a kind man, his wealth of knowledge and he just gives it away. I would give alot just to have one hour of his time.

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